Captain America: Brave New World star Anthony Mackie recently spoke about what it is that makes his character, Sam Wilson, tick.

For Blavity’s Shadow and Act, Mackie told Sharronda Williams how Sam’s former life as a counselor brings a different level of compassion to his role as Captain America.

 ”Well, that’s the great thing about Sam Wilson. I feel like a lot of people forgot when we first met Sam, he was a counselor, he was a vet, he was a leader of men. That’s one of the things Steve saw in him that really made him trust him and go bring him into the Avengers, because it takes a certain type of person to be a counselor. It takes a certain type of person to step outside of yourself, your own wants, your own desires, and listen to another person and their hard times and their bad things, and listen to that with no judgment. That takes compassion. And the big word that we kept coming back to [director Julius Onah] and I with this movie was compassion.”

Mackie also spoke about the presence of Carl Lumbly as the very first super-serum American hero, Isaiah Bradley. Mackie called Lumbly “one of the OG of OGs.”

“I’ll never forget the day that Kevin Feige called me and told me that we got Carl, ’cause Carl brings a certain level of gravitas to every role he plays,” said Mackie. “And in this movie, much like the show, there’s a, there’s a sadness, there’s a brokenness about him that really just destroys Sam Wilson because he sees the greatness of this man and there’s nothing he can do to help.”

“That’s the humanity about Sam Wilson. That’s the loyalty of Sam Wilson that I think everyone has grown to love and expect,” he continued. “‘Cause Sam Wilson is literally the best version of all of us.”

Watch the full cast interview above. Captain America: Brave New World comes to theaters Feb. 14